Wow. These pillows exceeded my expectations. I am addicted to down pillows but wanted something firm to provide support while reading in bed. Perfect! They are very firm while retaining the soft cloud-like feeling I associated with down pillows. For now, they are too firm for me to use as my sleeping pillow but experience tells me that down softens over the years and they may end up that way. They are an excellent value for the money- I have seen pillows with much less down in them for three times the price in department stores.